Ok, in a book I'm reading , the author posits that at some point when we reach a stage of advanced witchcraft, we quite possibly will no longer need the use of ritual tools in magickal workings. She believes our force of will may be all we need to focus our intent. I'm just curious to see if anyone else believes this may be true, or if anyone disagrees and why. Just my .
Okies, well I have the answer to this one - It is a Reality right now! Although the group that I run is still very much reliant on tools for extended ritual, as this aids in retaining the proper focus, we rarely employ any form of ritual tool for one off castings, usually just mentally casting a circle to prevent Infernal interruption.
This is mainly due to the school of hardknocks approach that we take to magick, but I think that everyone is able to do it, as long as they remember that the tools only allow focus, they do not have power.
On the other hand there are talismans and imbued objects which do have a power of their own, but these are the exception and not the rule as making them is hard enough and finiding the proper ritual is going to be downright impossible with the amount of teenage pandering pseudo-C$&p out there in the curent day..
Well that is what I think and know from current experience, but if anyoen would like more details, feel free to e mail or sign onto the torn moon site... you all know where it is ;)
Kalah aib enturaidas
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I agree, Sokar, they are very useful as guides for keeping your focus. I think many people get fixated on the idea that the power, the magick, is in the object when in fact it lies within the witch him/herself.
Many times we come across those that have the diehard attitude that you have to have one white handled knife and one black handled one, and you must have one of these wands that must be handmade, and a chalice for water and one for wine...yadda yadda yadda. I believe that if you do need to have tools to aid your focus, you can get by with the bare minimum because it is your intent that truly matters.
I guess it's kind of the same attitude I have towards churches that build these really ornate and gawdy buildings. I mean, is God really going to notice them more because they have the biggest and the prettiest building? Are the sermons of the preacher standing at that church's pulpit more powerful than that of a person standing on a street corner preaching what s/he believes to be true? No, just like Divinity won't look down on a witch conducting a healing ritual and say "Nope, they're not getting healed cause you aren't using the proper athame." I just don't think it works that way.
Well, i would have to agree. i do not think ritual tools are necessary if you have good visualization skills and focus. i hadn't thought of the talisman thing, and you may be right that the power they are invested with can not be duplicated just by your intent. But, as i love to say...."Anything is possible"!
Personally ( :) ) I feel "tools" are very useful. Of course, I fugure that is why any even use them. I do NOT feel they are absolutly needed. I do use them alot, because that is where I am. I think I am Very Ritualy inclined at this time and there is NO way I am gonna chuck them out the window just cause someone else says THEY no longer need them.
I am in NO way an Adept (you figured this out yet?) and YES I had heard that take on it from mainly theosophists ( was this a Fortune book? She had been with them also).
I am not anywhere near that point, so PLEASE give me my Incense and candles :)
No, Athames are not necessary, I kinda tend to use my fingers more after my time in Orlado. No way I gonna carry a "concealed" wepon, even in my trunk ( that I cared about).
Hey, I am getting somewhere;) (think that kinda threw them off tonight;).
Ok, mabey im strange...i actualy have 2 sets of tool and often use neither..one are what i would call my cerimonial set, used mainly for more ritualistic working..charm making..healing spells etc, the other set is more what you could call kitchen witch, more day to day, more shall we say intuative operations..however more and more often i find myself working within, within my mind that is without any phycical pressence..here i can be as ceramonial as i like...take as much time as i like..and the tools are cheaper in my head..that was a joke...however, i dont think no matter how profitient i get at visualization i will ever do away with my tools..there a good focus and something solid that i can draw back onto when ever my brain says " why are you doing this you idiot?"...please tell me im not the only one who gets that?
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no Elm your not I still once in awhile use my tools even though I know I do not really need them. My visualization skills are such that they are not needed but sometimes I utilise my tools more so as a prized blanket to fall back on.
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Ok this is how I view the use of the tools. I feel that they are useful for those that are beginning, but I feel that they should not be solely relied upon. Yes they are nice to have and to use, but I believe that the "magick" is within us all and the use of a specific tool is just an extension of this power. There have been many times that I have used whatever is readily available ie a packet of salt from a fast food place, a cup of water, and a plastic butter knife, at other times, it was simply me and visualization. I wish that people would try to use their own innate abilities without the usage of tools, because they are really not always useful or handy.
And this is only my two cents worth on this subject.
as some of you may know, one of my fields of interst is zen...one of it's underlying strengths is its, if you like, stripped down philosophy...in as much as if you work on you inner self through meditation and other strengthing excerseses you can achive anything...as we know 99.9% of magic is will power so if we can concentrate all our energies into a point when all things become irrelavent then we do not need tools in fact we do not need anything. personaly i am far from this point so i use them as a cruch if you like until such a point when i will not need them..when i'll probably shave mt head and go sit n a cloud somewhere,,lol
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this is an interesting thought Elm - and I believe it to be very true - and I can only hope that as I grow in my awareness - I am able to achieve a higher understnading of my tools, etc as well as my self - who knows - we both may someday be sitting by eachother on a cloud with very bald heads...
I'm actually in the process of reading another book that brings to light the idea that, while we may not actually need them, the author feels that it is still proper to use them on the theory that, all things being sacred and of the Gods/Deities/Source...whatever..., it shows honor and respect of those things. He states that, while they are not in and of themselves all powerful, being that they are also part of that which is sacred, they do hold their own power which can be added to our magick.
Just my
Heidi
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no I don't think you necessarily need tools... you make the rituals and spells your own. like your finger for an athame. I know alot of books talk about go get this and that...I don't think the god/goddess will even worry about what tool we are using. I do have some tools though that I use. But is my personal choice to use them not because so and so said I had to have them. I feel either way the you will feel the power with or without them.
Nah, they're only tools, a crutch. I don't think we need them at all, after a certain point.
I think this applies to rituals and divination and healing, anything you can think of like that that uses tools.
Sometimes we need to use the tool not for ourselves, but for other people.
I have a friend who does psychic readings. She's very good. When she goes to a psychic fair, she is the only tool she uses for readings. People pass by and wonder what's up.. they expect her to be using something; tarot, runes, anything.
She doesn't need those tools, but the people she reads for does. It makes it more real. They like seeing something in front of them, other than just words coming out of her mouth.
Just my $.02
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quote: Originally posted by: Esuisha " She doesn't need those tools, but the people she reads for does. It makes it more real. They like seeing something in front of them, other than just words coming out of her mouth."
That's true. Many others that may not be of the persuasion do seem to believe that the magick is in the cards, so to speak. I know it doesn't hurt to have 'props'.
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Many people need ritual objects in the beginning to tap into their power. There is a certain power in the tools and what they represent, when tools are consecrated, your subconcious attaches the desired power to the object. Once you begin to experience the fruits of your labor of rituals and spells, the subconcious is further nourished by these results. This is why a lot of people grow attached to certain sets of tools. The power remains there for them due to their subconcious tie and the energy which with they have imprinted the object. This imprint of energy also gives power to tools that have been passed down over generations. Each witch leaves their energy/power imprint on the tool and it grows very strong over time.
That said, this does not neccesarily mean that you NEED tools. The psychic mind is a very powerful thing, and this can be activated through prayer/fasting/chanting/meditation/chakra activation, etc. (This also is useful whether with or without tools)
ritual tools, in my opinion, nice to have , and if one feel`s they need a little extra focus on the day, their good to use, but, thats all they are , a focus nothing more or less. i have them and sometimes use them and when i do they feel good in my hands,as long as i have my incense and a few candles burning i`m happy, basically i think it`s up to the individual, do whatever feels right, and you cant go wrong
Ok, in a book I'm reading , the author posits that at some point when we reach a stage of advanced witchcraft, we quite possibly will no longer need the use of ritual tools in magickal workings. She believes our force of will may be all we need to focus our intent. I'm just curious to see if anyone else believes this may be true, or if anyone disagrees and why. Just my . Nellas
I find, in my study, that ritual tools are needed for some to have the ritual 'feel right'. When they are used in this manner the ritual becomes, at least in part, sympathetic magic. The tools are on more than one level in this case. Physical tools for sure, but also mental tools that help the person focus intention on the task at hand. If you think about it, that is a very good thinkg, since a stray thought could be very dangerous.
If your mind is clear enough, I don't see any reason for ritual tools, however, I really like them and even if I'm having a 'good day' I would still use them.
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, the author posits that at some point when we reach a stage of advanced witchcraft, we quite possibly will no longer need the use of ritual tools in magickal workings. She believes our force of will may be all we need to focus our intent. I'm just curious to see if anyone else believes this may be true, or if anyone disagrees and why. Just my 
.
Lady Nellas
